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cold start issues

M

mrblue01

New CEG'er
Joined
Nov 30, 2007
Messages
14
Location
Westland, MI
I did a bunch of searching, and saw that a couple people had similar issues, but I never found a definite solution.

I just bought this 96 Contour a week ago. Its a Zetec 4 cyl and auto tranny. 90k miles old in Michigan.

The first night we had below freezing here the car wouldnt start. It cranks over great, and tries to fires... keeps stumbling... but never lights up. I cranked it over at least 10 tries. Drive the truck to work instead.

AFter work, pull the plugs... soaking wet with gas. I changed them and swapped in a new fuel filter since it was easy.

it ran fine for the next two warmish days, but this morning was real cold again (20ish) and it didnt start the first time, but barely got running the 2nd time with a bit of throttle when it started coughing (while cranking).

the CTS shows good resistance, as does the IATS.

I have a CEL on. Autozone ran the codes and says its the heater element in the O2 sensor, and something about the evap canister. Thats it.

Tomorrow I'm going to clean out the IAC motor. I have an cam sensor and a crank sensor ready to go in, but I hate throwing money at this car already.

Anyone figure this out?

Thanks in advance... this site has been a great help already!
Jeff
 
for the engine to run you need
fuel - your plugs are wet so no problem there
compression - it doesn't come and go with temp so no prob there
spark - ???
air - ???

IAC getting stuck with the cold?
spark not strong enough to ignite cold mixture?
spark timing not adjusting for temp?
 
A couple updates:

I changed the IAC today with a new one from Autozone... no change

Borrowed a fuel pressure gauge... I think it was 38 with the key on, 33 while running, and 40 with the line pulled off the regulator... so the pump looks good.

The codes from AZ:
P0141 - heater circuit of the oxygen sensor
P1443 - EVAP canister purge valve mechanical fault

I don't believe either of these affect the start up issues.

Just to make sure I was clear, this hard start is much worse with the cold temperatures. It has been fine if the temp is over 35-40 or so.

The car has great power, decent idle, 30 mpg... I just got back from the test run and did a WOT highway on ramp through 3 gears. It really runs strong

Air: clean air filter, throttle body looks good, IAC is now new.
Spark: new plugs, new wires, new coil
Fuel: fuel pressure is good, new filter, put in a bottle of injector cleaner last fuel tank.

What do you guys think of the cam position sensor? What would effect the spark timing vs cold weather?

Any other ideas?

Thanks again!
 
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quote:

Check battery voltage. If it is less than stellar, it could be the reason.

I'll check tomorrow, but it cranks like mad for a good minute or more

Were the spark plugs gapped to 0.050 inch?

yes

What brand sp wires?

not sure, propably a cheap set.
 
you may not have a battery that is very strong for cold cranking situations. If it's only giving you good juice for only a minute I would replace the battery. If the battery in your truck is good, through that in there on the next cold morning and see what happens. My guess is that it will crank easily.

The CCA (cold cranking amps) of a battery tell you how good it will be in cold temps. Personally, I go for the higher CCA batteries I can get.
 
sorry if I wasnt clear. The battery is still cranking great after a minute. I'm sure it has a lot more power in it... I just give up on the car starting by then.
 
I'm sure this isn't a battery issue.

I'm still voting for spark system. Plugs, wires, coil, etc ...

unless one of the CEL codes puts the car at the wrong a/f ratio.
 
I am starting to run out of ideas. My best guess is an A/F ratio issue.

Last night,I found the large o-ring that seals the throttle body to the intake had been lodged sideways and may have created a major leak there. I fixed that, but it again, wouldnt start easy this morning. And it was only 35 deg F.

I crank on it for 10 secs and it stumbles a few times but no start... So I crank on it again for 10 sec and the stumbling starts to go away... So I try a last ditch effort of putting the gas pedal to the floor and it stumbles again and cleares itself out and fires up real slow. A big cloud of gasiline smelling smoke comes out the tailpipe.

So if the theory is true that WOT shuts off the injectors, then something else is telling the car to go extremly rich at normal start up.

Both the CTS and the IAT sensors have the same resistance values, but they dont seem to match the values that they should for 35 degrees. If one of these were bad I wouldnt think they would both read the same value. (they both fluctuate the same running them under hot and cold water in the kitchen sink.)

any ideas given this new input?
 
Put a new FORD OEM IAC valve (and gasket) for that year in and see what happens.
 
Not sure if this will help, but I had a very similar problem with a 91 civic. Thought it as the coil pack, but it turned out to be the igniter housed in the distributor. I believe the ignitor has a different name on some cars. It turned out to be the wire that connects the ignitor in my case.

Basically, when cold, the car would crank but not fire. By the time cranking it brought up the temperature enough to fire with a weak spark, the car was flooded.
 
martinmalley said:
Not sure if this will help, but I had a very similar problem with a 91 civic. Thought it as the coil pack, but it turned out to be the igniter housed in the distributor. I believe the ignitor has a different name on some cars. It turned out to be the wire that connects the ignitor in my case.

Basically, when cold, the car would crank but not fire. By the time cranking it brought up the temperature enough to fire with a weak spark, the car was flooded.
Click to expand...
The closest we have to an igniter wire in the distributor would be the wire going to the coil pack or the wires going to the SP.
 
Well, I had a buddy come over with an official Ford diagnostic tool (nice thing about living in Detroit)... and everything checks out. All sensors read the proper temps, etc. Good spark, proper fuel pressure, even power at all cylinders.

Get this, cool little tool told us that in 1997 there were several TSB's for hard starts in cold weather and a new engine calibration was released. My car, however, did not recieve the new calibration (yet). The dealer wants $90 for a reflash of the computer, but I am going to try and pull some strings with my Ford contacts to get me the file a little cheaper.:laugh:

These TSB's can be found on the net TSB 13386, 5203, 9741, 12174

I'll let you know how it works out.
 
how much gas is in the car???
thats a big question!!
if you are low on gas, this may allow the water in your gas tank (we all have at least some) to crystalize to some degree which in turn could possibly (temporarily) clog the fuel filter.
Only subzero temps can expose this problem.
Did you check your fuel pressure in above 35f weather.....if so, then no problem would show, but in subzero temps, that problem may show its face.
You may want to get some water remover (Lucas or Chevron) from Murray's/Auto Zone and run that 2x with 2 half tank fills to insure its effectiveness.

For the future never let your car get below 1/4 tank in the extreme cold even if this is not the problem as the gas we buy now does contain water. FYI :cool:
 
mrblue01 said:
Well, I had a buddy come over with an official Ford diagnostic tool (nice thing about living in Detroit)... and everything checks out. All sensors read the proper temps, etc. Good spark, proper fuel pressure, even power at all cylinders.

Get this, cool little tool told us that in 1997 there were several TSB's for hard starts in cold weather and a new engine calibration was released. My car, however, did not recieve the new calibration (yet). The dealer wants $90 for a reflash of the computer, but I am going to try and pull some strings with my Ford contacts to get me the file a little cheaper.:laugh:

These TSB's can be found on the net TSB 13386, 5203, 9741, 12174

I'll let you know how it works out.
Click to expand...

well that sounds promising! Let us know if it works and keep those strings handy (just in case one of us needs the help).
 
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