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gas with ethanol

erb13

CEG'er
Joined
Aug 30, 2002
Messages
36
I just finished using a tank of Sunoco premium gas, 93 octane that had 10% ethanol added, at least that is what the sticker on the pump stated. My mileage took a major drop from my usual 24mpg to 19mpg with no hcange to my driving patterns. Is this normal for the Contour SVT? What have others experienced using gas with ethanol?

erb13
1998 SVT - totally stock
 
Yes. In Oklahoma we only have 91 Octane and it is not mandated that gas stations notify when using 10% ethenol.

I religously check my fuel milage and noticed after one tank I lost nearly 40 miles. Went from 24-25mpg to ~20. Discovered later that QT has switched to a 10% ethenol blend and did not mark the pumps. :censored: :censored: :censored:

I have since switched to using a Conoco station that does not have ethenol. My milage is back to 24-25 again.
 
I just finished using a tank of Sunoco premium gas, 93 octane that had 10% ethanol added, at least that is what the sticker on the pump stated. My mileage took a major drop from my usual 24mpg to 19mpg with no hcange to my driving patterns. Is this normal for the Contour SVT? What have others experienced using gas with ethanol?

erb13
1998 SVT - totally stock

Ethanol contains less energy than gasoline, so it will yield lower fuel economy. However, the drop you're experiencing is nearly 25%, more than you'd see with 10% ethanol. Keep in mind the colder weather also takes a toll on fuel economy, with engines running rich for more prolonged periods during warmup, thus consuming more fuel.
 
I thought you had better combustion due to higher density air. I thought gas mileage increased during winter???
 
I thought you had better combustion due to higher density air. I thought gas mileage increased during winter???


More dense air means MORE energy to burn, thus requiring MORE fuel to keep the same ratio, thus using MORE fuel per cycle, thus more likely LOWERING mileage.

You get more POWER in colder air, but not really "better mileage"
 
As was said, there is more gas-wasting warmup time in the colder months. In the summer, when you start your car on an 80 degree day, the coolant comes up to temperature quickly, the 02 sensors heat up right away, and the ECU goes into closed loop fuel control within a minute or two of driving. In the winter, you start the car, let it idle for a while or whatever you do, and it takes much longer for the ECU to reach closed loop. Until it does, it runs in the much less efficient open loop mode where the amount of fuel injected is estimated based on a default (and overly rich, just to be safe) fuel map, rather than using the 02 sensors to determine the air-fuel ratio.

I would say that most of the decrease in fuel mileage can be attributed to this. Additionally, people tend to make more short trips in the winter, causing a decrease in economy. There's also the theory that fuel doesn't vaporize well when injected in cold weather- this is true, but in my opinion the first few seconds of engine operation heat things up enough to negate this effect. It was certainly true with carburated engines, but fuel injection really isn't affected much except maybe in extremely cold climates not really seen in the lower 48 states.

Cold makes us just plain lazy too- I noticed my tires looked a little low like two weeks ago (Usually I check them every week or so) but it's been cold and rainy here in NJ and I just never found the motivation to put more air in them. It's little things like that, they add up. Winter sucks, and it hasn't even (technically) started yet!
 
Continuing my discussion, there was no change in the weather and no change to the driving pattern, so the only change I can see was in the fuel. I have read that ethanol has a lower energy density, (extractable energy from a unit volume) than gas so I wasn't surprised by the lower mpg. What I was surprised by was the size of the change. I saw or felt no change in engine performance or driveability just a major reduction in mpg. So I guess the answer is read the pump labels and do not buy gas with ethanol.

erb13
 
...So I guess the answer is read the pump labels and do not buy gas with ethanol...

If you can find it! We're stuck with it here in Massachusetts. Hey, I'd take the old Methyl Tertiary Butyl Ether (MTBE) if they'd let us. Fuel economy was better, and it's not corrosive like ethanol, so it stores better if you're not driving the car regularly. :cool:
 
Same in NY, it's mandated. Nothing like the price of gas going up insanely high, and then forcing us to use something that causes us to use more gas... :rolleyes:
 
I hate 10% ethanol fuel, I try to avoid it whenever possible.

When Sunoco accidentally gave us a 10% ethanol blend for our race series, all kinds of teams had serious trouble with it. Nobody could figure out why thier fuel cell foam was disintegrating and making its way through all the filters and clogging the fuel injectors . . . I can't tell you how long it took us to figure it out. We must have sent 4 or 5 sets of injectors out to be cleaned and reflowed after that fiasco.
 
isnt the F1 U.S series running ethanol??

Probably not, since there is no such thing as a US Formula 1 series . . .

In a race car, if you know you're getting ethanol, there are things you can do to deal with it, but if you get ethanol because the mandated fuel supplier for your series screwed up and didn't tell you, it's ugly.
 
Houston Texas and the counties surrounding it are required to burn (up to 10%) ethanol and post signs on the pumps. I took a trip to Arkansas 2 weeks ago and topped off my tank with real gasoline on the way there - my gas mileage increased by 3 mpg. I was surpised the old tour still got good mileage. Best was 28 mpg on East Texas 59N. My brother experiences the same with his CR-V when he travels outside the ethanol area.
Someone please explain how we are helping the US and the environment by burning more fuel per mile and exhaling more exhaust?
 
The exhaust is far less pollutant. Just check out a little research on it if you are truly concerned.
 
We've gotten smog out of gasoline but are not adding it back.

http://www.heritage.org/Research/EnergyandEnvironment/bg2020.cfm

Not sure I follow your statement...

Interesting article and generally factual, but ethanol doesn't all have to come from corn. The stupid sugar cane industry down here in Florida is heavily subsidized by the feds. The big cane growers could go back to earning an honest living by selling for the production of fuel.

Further, remember programs that pay farmers to NOT grow crops? I do. By allowing them to plant and harvest unused acreage the gov't saves money & the impact on the food supply is less. Shift the burden of maintaining adequate crop pricing back to the market, not the government.

All things considered, I think that hydrogen and solar electric hybrids will be the next big thing. Fill the water tank and while the car is driving or parked the solar panels can be producing more hydrogen for the fuel cell. When hydrogen fuel gets low, the car can run on the solar cells and batteries.
 
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