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Need some experitise--bad wiring??

K

krad77

New CEG'er
Joined
Feb 7, 2007
Messages
17
Location
Ohio
Ok--first off. We're talking about a 98.5 contour SVT, stock. Repairs done so far--new alternator, new plugs and wires, new fuel filter. This car has been a little sickly recently. Basically, it seems the car is losing power, jerking, big time, throughout the driving range. It often runs fine, but some days it wakes up on the wrong side of the garage, and just doesn't want to work right. We all have days like that, sure :cool: Anyway, the check engine kicks on and off, can't remember the codes, sorry, but the catalytic has been associated with these codes. Catalytics have been tested, and came back clean. Whens its really bad, the car won't even start-turns over but won't start. Today,for instance, running bad as soon as I backed it out. The RPM needle just dropped suddenly with the jerking. No noises, just the sudden loss of power. At a stop light, the rpm needle was trying to hit zero, trying to die on me and I had to pull over and do some investigating. We have observed that a certain connecter might be at fault. The lock was broken when we replaced the alternator. I am going to attach a couple of pics to look at. When I fiddled around with said connector today, the car started back up and didn't have any of the above symptoms again today. HMMMM...... However, another ongoing problem kicked in. When the clutch is engaged, the car revs up to 3-4000 rpms. Makes me sound like a jackass, and probably wastes gas to boot. Once again, doesn't do it all the time, just when the car is in a bad mood :eek: So, if there is anyone out there who has some good advice on this problem, we would be much obliged. My husband and Dad are going to poke around tomorrow and see what they can come up with. Hopefully, something productive. Thanks again for any useful input.
 

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Welcome. Check spark plug wiring order and sp gaps.

Edit. Duratec V6 Spark Plug wiring order. Note the 4-6-5 for the coil pack near the firewall side.

Firewall side
4- 6 -5 <--coil pack
3-2-1

1-2-3 <--engine
4-5-6
Radiator side

Spark Plug gap 0.054 inch

How many miles on the engine?

"the check engine kicks on and off, can't remember the codes",

Drive to Autozone or Advance, get codes read (free service), then post exact codes here.

"Today,for instance, running bad as soon as I backed it out. The RPM needle just dropped suddenly with the jerking. No noises, just the sudden loss of power. At a stop light, the rpm needle was trying to hit zero, trying to die on me and I had to pull over and do some investigating. We have observed that a certain connecter might be at fault. The lock was broken when we replaced the alternator. I am going to attach a couple of pics to look at. When I fiddled around with said connector today, the car started back up and didn't have any of the above symptoms again today. HMMMM......"

Yes, a bad alternator or alternator not charging could have those symptoms.


"When the clutch is engaged, the car revs up to 3-4000 rpms. Makes me sound like a jackass, and probably wastes gas to boot."

Moose.
http://www.contour.org/ubbthreads/s...er=1148660&page=&view=&sb=5&o=&fpart=all&vc=1
 
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Well, the man says that he plugged back exactly how they were before. I'll have check more in depth tomorrow. Still, that dang connector.....hmmm.....
Thanks
 
Tony rocks. I think I see him post something extremely useful, or in the right direction in every single troubleshooting post.
 
krad77 said:
We have observed that a certain connecter might be at fault. The lock was broken when we replaced the alternator. I am going to attach a couple of pics to look at. When I fiddled around with said connector today, the car started back up and didn't have any of the above symptoms again today. HMMMM...... However, another ongoing problem kicked in. When the clutch is engaged, the car revs up to 3-4000 rpms....
Click to expand...

I don't have schematics for your year car but going by my 96 factory service manual, the connector in question is #180F which has circuits for the IMRC, which could be why you get the intermediate high RPMs. The wires to the heated O2 sensor Bank 2 top(radiator side top one) is also part of that 6 wire connector.
Are you sure the lock tab is broken? It takes a firm push together to lock that connector up. You can hear/see when it locks up properly.
Make sure all the wires to the connnectors are fully seated in.
 
Without codes it is hard to find a problem.

However, if you suspect something electrical stat here.
For the no start and intermittent bucking/ stalling I would check the crank and cam sensors and ECT sensor.

For the high rev again check the ECT sensor (very very common problem)

Before replacing a suspected sensor check the harness and connector (s). This goes double for a 10 year old car.

Again a code scan would help.

jeff
 
Ok--quick update. First--thanks for the input. Spark plug wires are in the correct order. We are relatively sure it is the connectors in the above pics. The top connector was suspect, but it seems it is the connector directly below it. The car was running really, and I mean really, rough today for me and the hubby both. He pulled over and barely poked at the suspect connector, and the car just died. Not good. So, I assume we have a problem there. I suppose replacing them isn't so simple. I think for now we will put some of that grease/gel that prevents moisture from getting in but conducts electricity--sorry, don't know the technical name. Hopefully, that will help it. If any one out there has some useful suggestions on replacing/repairing aging connectors for the wiring harness, that would be really, really appreciated. We are living with a really tight budget, so that presents a problem. Thanks in advance for any input. If I get an engine code, I will post it. I must admit, I don't remember them, and I didn't write them down--bad me. The most recent one involved the catalytic converter. But, had the catalytics tested and they passed.
 
Did the car have these symtoms before the Alternator was changed?

Did the mechanic disconnect the two 12 wire and one 6 wire connectors, show in the pictures you supplied, when he did the job?

If you add any conductive grease to the connectors, don't add too much or it will make it harder to properly lock them together.

I tried to copy one of your pictures to "PAINT", but couldn't get it to work.
I wanted to point out the area of the connector that provides the lock feature. I hope the mechanic didn't break them.

How many miles are on the car?
 
Our SVT has about 128000 miles on it. I am mystified as to why you couldn't get the pics to work in paint. I saved them to my desktop, and they opened up in paint fine for me:shrug: Anyway, the mechanics in question were my husband and dad, the lock was indeed broken when the alternator was replaced. The top connector is zip-tied shut, but we now discovered the that the second one down is causing the issue, we think. Barely tap it and the car dies. The lock on the suspect connector isn't broken-yet-but is loose. We were not having the current problem prior to replacing the alternator. Sometimes, the car runs like a beast on a testosterone trip, but other days, more often recently, it has some serious power issues. Our poor SVT needs some help:nonono: Thanks again to all for their suggestions.
 
I wanted to add a quick note that the check engine light is not on at the moment. When it turns on again, which seems inevitable, I will get a readout again, and I will make a point to write them down. I must confess, the absentminded professor has nothing on me, (insert grin). I don't want you all to think that my dad and husband are a couple of Ohio bumpkins who don't know diddly crap about auto repair, either. They do alright--my dad has been repairing cars for almost 40 years, even if his "garage" has often been a backyard somewhere. My husband is a smart fellow, though not as experienced. Anyway....
 
Are you aware that some of the 98 and 99 models had wiring harness problems. Look over the link below. Do you see any connectors around the engine compartment that look like the ones explained in the link? The fuel injector harness usually is in the worse shape. These models didn't fall under this recall but many people on CEG have had this problem. The picture you provided doesn't show any problem on those two connnectors.

http://www.contour.org/FAQ/recall/99M03/
 
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It could be a good Idea to check the harnesses. When I did my alt. I had to replace the main PCM harness that goes to it and a few other plugs cause of the recall issue. Never could talk ford int warrantying it cause the recall supposedly only affected 95-97:rolleyes:
 
Oh, thats great to know. Thanks for the heads up, fellows. I'm assuming buying a replacement is a little pricey? And where is the least expensive place to purchase one? Thanks again.
 
Does the car start now?
If it cranks but won’t start do this,
Check for fuel pressure with a gauge.
If the FP is good 30-40psi, then check for spark and injector pulse. If you have no spark and no pulse, then check the crank sensor circuit (and cam sensor too). Here is how you do that.

A scanner would report lack of signals from the sensors but won’t tell you if the cable or sensor is bad. But knowing what signal is missing makes for faster resolution.

You will need a good DVM set for low ohms and a thin set of test probes and the correct wiring diagram.

When you test an automotive connector you always “Back probe” it. In other words you insert the test lead from the wire side between the wire and soft rubber until you make contact with the terminal. This avoids damage to the terminal from the test probe.

Start with the crank sensor; it has two signal leads and a shield wire. Locate the correct pin on the PCM connector for one of the leads and back probe one of the ohm meter leads to it. Next remove the connector from the crankshaft sensor and back probe the corresponding lead. You have to remove the connector from the sensor side for this test to be valid. Check the ohm meter it should read zero ohms (no resistance). Now go wiggle the connectors in the picture and move the harness around. The meter must stay rock solid. Any jumping of the display indicates a harness problem.
Next remove the probe from the sensor connector and ground it (the battery is the best place. The ohm meter should now read open or infinite resistance (actually depending on the meter you may get a reading of several thousand or million ohms). What we are looking for here is a short to ground and that would read low ohms. Wiggle the harness again and check the meter it again should read steady (hi ohms this time) any jumping indicates bad insulation between the shield and signal leads.

Repeat this test for the other lead and the also for the two leads of the camshaft sensor and ECT sensor while you are at it (this can cause intermittent high idle). If all checks good, test the sensors with an ohm meter and compare the reading to the values given in the service manual. This is not a very good way to test a sensor but it will indicate an open or short.

If the wiring checks out good, reconnect everything a try to start. If it fires you could have an intermittent sensor.

I had a crank sensor that would quite when I wiggled the wire near the valve cover. Knowing what is missing would help you decide what to replace.

Good luck
jeff
 
Ok--check engine light decided to kick on yesterday. so, I went to Auto Zone and had them run codes. Here is what came up--P0188, Engine Coolant Temperature, high input or something along those lines. P0320, Ignition/Distributor Engine speed input malfunction. While I was there, I picked up a multi-meter, so we could do the checks that Jeff was kind enough to suggest in the above post--thanks. We cleaned some corrosion off of the bottom connector, which is a little loose. Husband put in a little dielectric gel to seal out moisture. Today, it ran just fine, even though check engine light was on. Check engine is now off, though. Again, any suggestions are most appreciated, and I'll check back in once we run some tests. Thanks!!
 
krad77 said:
Here is what came up--P0188, Engine Coolant Temperature, high input or something along those lines. P0320, Ignition/Distributor Engine speed input malfunction.
Click to expand...

188 ECT is the engine coolant sensor. This is responsible for the hi-idle problem and can sometimes cause a warm engine not to start. You can remove it and test it with your DVM using the ohms scale. The service manual has the hot and cold resistance readings. Use hot and cold water. Don’t confuse it with the temperature gauge sender. Check the wiring with the DVM and inspect the connector.

The 320 is for the crankshaft sensor. This will cause an intermittent no start condition if the wiring or the sensor is bad. The do have a tendency to go bad in an intermittent fashion.

Fix these two items and you will be back in business.

jeff
 
I read over the posts to some extent, but if I'm repeating something I apoligize.

I noticed right off the bat that the pictures you are showing is of the connector which runs the crank and cam position sensors (white w/red stripe, brown w/red stripe, black w/yellow stripe, black w/blue stripe). Yes I have these wires memorized due to all the problems they gave me.

All of the symptoms you are describing I experienced in the past. You need to check the wiring going down to the crank and cam sensors. The cam sensor is right below the front cylinder head valve cover, directly above and to the left of the A/C compressor pulley when standing on the passenger side looking across the engine. The crank sensor is directly below the cam sensor near the crank pulley.

Disconnect the plugs to these sensors and inspect the wiring insulation. Chances are they are cracked and very brittle. You can fix the issue by rewiring the harness (which is very time consuming, but this is what I did) or you can purchase a new wiring harness from Ford, which will run you about $650 (or possible pull one from a junk yard).

Also check the wiring going to your coil pack. I found that the purple w/red stripe wire also showed the cracking insulation and was causing my engine to misfire.

All of the above are simply sanity checks and can be performed in a matter of minutes and requires no tools. I would highly recommend searching the old archive forums for post that both myself and Tony have made as this very issue has been discussed at great length on many occasions.

Good luck.
 
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