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clutch, pressure plate, tob or clutch slave

BrApple

No Life But CEG
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Dec 23, 2001
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so I have alittle bit of a clutch issue with my SE. its a spec stage 3+, installed with a new ford tob.

it seems air keeps getting into the clutch line. for the last 4 days I have had to bleed the clutch daily to make it work. it will shift perfectly fine when the engine isn't running but it will not go into gear when running. It also was shifting fine after I bleed the clutch. If I put it in gear while the engine isn't running and then start it I can use the clutch but still can't really shift gears. I can feel it dragging at times too. Also at times now I get a wirling/sprinning/grinding type sound when I have the clutch pedal on the floor. coming off the clutch pedal alittle makes the noise stop.

I am thinking its a hydraulic system problem, maybe clutch slave or tob but I am not sure. from what i know there is no fluid leak, brakes work fine. fluid level dropped because i bleed the clutch so many times.
 
I would definitely re-bleed the system. First thing I did was use a vacuum bleeder to get the intial majority of air out when I did my clutch. Then I had my brother pump the pedal slowly to remove any remaining air. Make sure the bleeder screw is closed completely when you release the pedal.

You could also run clear tubing from the bleeder screw to the brake/clutch fluid reservior and slowly pump the pedal while watching for air bubbles coming up the tube. This way you dont loose fluid. Occasionally force the pedal down (with the bleeder open) to maybe force any extra air out of the clutch master cyl. or slave cyl.
 
yeah I am going to bleed the whole hydraulic system again. however I bleed the clutch like a dozen times in the last week, once a morning pressty much to make it work. over night it would sit and in the morning it wouldn't work ...
 
well using the self bleeder I have last night the clutch worked for about 5 minutes until is started dragging again. Brakes work fine.

So again slave or tob? The tob is making noise at times anyway so I should pull the mtx to check everything anyway. Just shouldn't know if I should bother with the slave at all since the tob will bleed.
 
Fuggin change the slave first since it's older and inexpensive.

Didnt you say it was a new slave?




no it is original to the car. the tob was installed ~7k ago with the mtx, clutch and 3L.

I did find that the left from caliper was leaking alittle from the bleeder. bleed that and the clutch but got nothing. fairly certain the clutch slave is working fine since it was bleeding fluid, but since its cheap I am thinking of just replacing it first.
 
Isn't the TOB and slave a assembly on the mtx's

Thats what I thought too.

Well good lord, I don't know why you would have the whole MTX out and ONLY replace the TOB??! :nonono: Time to rip'r apart..


clutch slave, clutch master, call it what you want, its located on the clutch pedal and is like the brake master cylinder ....

the tob assembly is located in the mtx.

they are two seperate parts in two locations. one, both or neither might be my problem. I could just throw parts at the problem and start with the clutch slave for $40, but I just want to go though the reasoning and thought process. no need to have to fight with it if it isn't needed.

ok so teamfordparts online calls it out as clutch master and slave (tob assemble).


but back to my point/question. if I can bleed the clutch but it still doesn't work would that indicate that the clutch master is ok?
 
No, the clutch master cylinder is what is pressed by the clutch pedal.

The slave cylinder is where the hydraulic fluid from above goes. Then the slave cylinder pushes the Throw out Bearing (TOB!) into the pressure plate..

The slave cylinder is located IN the mtx ALONG WITH the TOB.

So. There is a proper name, we're not just calling it what we want.. Can you see brake fluid leaking from the lower part of the bell housing? If so, that is your SLAVE cylinder leaking. (it could just be from bleeding the clutch slave so be careful to not jump to conclusions..)

I dont know how possible this is, but there are o-rings at the disconnect for the hydraulic line for the clutch. Under pressure (pressing the pedal) the o-rings may not leak because fluid presses the o-rings for a tight seal. But when you release the pedal, the clutch master is under suction which might draw in slight pocket of air which would accumulate over time.. thus giving a spongy pedal.

With that in mind, check all the connections because even a threaded connection could do this. Do you have any leaks anywhere??
 
No leaks that I know off. Only spot recently that I noticed was on a front caliper. Really no sign of fluid from between the bellhousing and the block. Last time I tried bleeding the clutch I got fluid from it. Looked at the lines today and there where no signs of leaks anywhere.
 
I had similar problem that I fixed before SZ09 and it was my slave cylinder leaking fluid I would bleed it and it work okay but if you held the clutch pedal down you could literally feel the fluid leak out. but I had fluid leaking out of the bell housing... not a lot but enough.... I'd get under the car and have someone pump the pedal and see if any fluid leaks out.

the master cylinder would definately be easier to change and apparently cheaper it is however inside the car mounted to the pedal assembly if it were leaking it would be onto the floor under the carpet maybe smell break fluid.

I'm betting on the slave cylinder:blackeye: not uncommon for brand new ones to come apart on the back of the Slave and leak fluid.... good luck welcome to the dark side of hydraulic clutches:cry:
 
well I have not seen any evidence of a fluid leak from the clutch hydraulic system. I have not noted the fluid level dropping either. the slave/tob was a new ford unit that was fitted to the mtx when it was inspected and then sent to me. again for awhile now it has been making a squeaking noise when the clutch is out at idle. when it started acting up I can sometime hear a grinding/spinning type noise when the pedal is on the floor. if i let up alittle it would stop making the noise.

sadly my SVT also does something similar from time to time. It happened alot over this past weekend. it will become dificult to shift into or out of gear when not moving. however a few pumps of the clutch or getting moving again make it go away.
 
You may even have some gunky deposits in the master or slave cylinders. My buddy's civic would intermittently do this where he could feel crunching in the pedal and he would have to push the clutch pedal to the floor to disengage the clutch. The debris may be allowing fluid around the rubber seals within the cylinders. I have seen this happen to brake master cylinders.
 
both cars have had the brake fluid in the resivior removed and repalced and then all four brakes and clutch where bleed.
 
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