Newer PCM (possibly SVT) in a pre-98

[rkneeshaw]

Searched but having a hard time finding clear answers to this question.

We are having trouble getting my 96 SE tuned right and the idea to install a newer PCM that is easier to tune has been presented. The 96 is OBD-II but to my knowledge does not have PATS. I'd like to go with a SVT ECU, and any one of the following are recommended by my tuner:

early 1998(May1997)-98.5 SVT -- RJL1
98-99 SVT -- SFG0
99 SVT SFG2
99 SVT MNQ2 (rare)
99-00 SVT returnless XGT1

So I'm wondering a couple things: Did ALL SVT's have PATS and what would I need to do to bypass it? And in my searching I found a reference to the removed gas cap CEL sensors... would that be a problem (i.e. constant CEL) since that my 96 probably doesnt have the hardware for the related diagnostic tests that the ECU performs? Or other than potential PATS issues would this be plug and play?

[Barge]

If you wanted to use an SVT ECU you would need a return style one since your car is a return style fuel system.

I doubt that the pinouts of the 2 ECU's match and some of the sensors are probably different. The would have to be brought in line to make it work.

You would need some kind of PATS bypass.

Most of the ODB2 checks and CEL's should be bypassable in the ECU.

[rkneeshaw]

I doubt that the pinouts of the 2 ECU's match and some of the sensors are probably different. The would have to be brought in line to make it work.

Crap, thats right, on the 3L block I remember we had to re-tap for one of my '96 sensors, like crank pos sensor or something.... it had a different connector than the one on the 3L block. Sounds like a major PITA with no guarantee of success. :(

[Barge]

You could swap the whole wiring harness and stuff if you could find a donor car.

[warmonger]

Any 1997 pcm should do the trick. The RJL1 is the earliest SVT pcm.
Also, buckeyeSVT on fco swapped in an svt pcm direct plug and play with an SE contour and had not issues with pats that I heard of. I imagine you could just search up on fco and see what he did or just try it then solve those issues as they come up.
You could just use the whole harness as barge said or reposition any pins in your current harness. Shouldn't be too bad, maybe a couple hours work with your harness and two wiring pinouts for the each year of pcm.

[RodneyBur]

1998 SVT ECU Part # F8RF-AB Code RJL1 build 4/97 7/97 9/97
**warning** These are not compatible with the cougar PATS system (see link below). They have the PATS system external from the ECU, meaning that the pats system in that year Contour will still engage without any ecu in car. The keys are programmed to the car's systems elsewhere other than the ECU.



http://www.newcougar.org/forums/2-5l-duratec-performance/96851-svt-ecu-information.html


I've had some experience with this issue myself. The earlier pats systems in the contours are external from the ECU where as later (post 98) ECU has the pats system integrated into the ECU.

Basically this is what happened to me:
Bought RJL1 ECU for use in 99 Cougar.
Upon installing the PATS light blinked constantly and would not link up to Ford programming for resetting of pats to my KEY.
I purchased the next edition SVT ECU and it worked.

I tested the RJL1 ECU in a 97 built contour SE. No pats reprogramming needed. I just plugged in the ECU and the car started up and ran fine (for the 1/1000th of a second I had the running).

From what I can tell running around the junkyards looking for my replacement ECU all the parts are the same for the pre-98 Contours. Here is a link to the PATS dates for fords:

http://www.sievekingprodco.com/helpspg1504.html


The RJL1 ECU should do the trick for you. I would get a pinout reading (on Ford CD) fo the ECU harness and doublecheck that they are all the same. Its easy enough to do and will guarantee that the job is done right the first time.

[rkneeshaw]

I tested the RJL1 ECU in a 97 built contour SE. No pats reprogramming needed. I just plugged in the ECU and the car started up and ran fine (for the 1/1000th of a second I had the running).

wow, 1/1000th of a second! So when you say it ran fine.....

As far as I know most of the sensors should even be the same with the exception of a certain sensor on the back of the engine block (firewall side). When we put my 3L in we had to re-tap the hole it screwed into so that I could re-use my stock sensor which attaches to the stock harness. If I swap out the whole harness I think I'll run into problems here.

EDIT: I remember now, it was the knock sensor. We kept my stock knock sensor and re-tapped the block to accomidate it. I beleive the newer knock sensors use a different connector. Since its only a knock sensor, its probably wired the same at the ECU so it probably wont be an issue. At least thats my guess.

I have a Ford CD for my '96 contour so I can get the pinouts for my stock ECU. If I can get someone to post the pinouts for a '98 I could compare.

[todras]

I have a spare 98 SVT PCM I think. Eurotour has it right now. I think it's an RJL1 too.

[Bradness]

Here's what I know. I also have a 96 which is getting a 3.0 transplant. I have a 98 SVT PCM with Pats. I also have the key and the Pats ring which is normally located around the key lock cylinder in the steering column. To date I have not checked the wiring diagram, although the 96 & 98 both use return type fuel system.

My guess is that the pinouts on both PCM's are the same (or very similiar). Now the Pats ring has 3 wires coming off of it so the trick w/b to find where they terminate. The other issue is what happens if the wires are simply left disconnected? Someone mentioned that the early Pats system was external to the PCM. What exactly does that mean?

The later, more desirable from a swap point of view 3.0's, use the smaller threaded (8mm?) knock sensor vs. 12mm knock sensor for the 2.5. Simplest method is to drill and tap the 3.0 block for use with the 2.5 sensor. My experience is that Ford changed ALL the wiring connectors when they went to OBD2 (95-96) and then there was another change (not everything) around 2000. I've owned both a 95 & a 96.

[rkneeshaw]

Someone mentioned that the early Pats system was external to the PCM. What exactly does that mean?


I'm assuming that means we can just plug the PCM in, and start it up and not worry about PATS. Rodney mentioned he simply plugged the unit into a 97 contour and it started, which means that PATS wasnt necessary. If PATS was an issue, the car woiuldnt' have turned over.

[RodneyBur]

wow, 1/1000th of a second! So when you say it ran fine.....


Yea it kinda took me by surprise that the car started. When it turned over and started on the first revolution I about shat my pants. I immediately turned the key back and shut it off. I didn't want to damage the car and was worried about the non-SVT cams, injectors, etc. and the difference settings in the ECU.

My goal was just to test what happened when a Non-pats programed key tried to turnover the engine. I needed to find out if the engine cranked or just sat idle. I was trying to figure out if it was an ECU issue or PATS issue in my Cougar. Obviously it was the ECU issue.

[Bradness]

"I was trying to figure out if it was an ECU issue or PATS issue in my Cougar." So did you plug the PCM into your Cougar or an early Contour?

My 95 had ABS and it was controlled by a seperate, external computer module. Wonder if that was how the PATS worked for E0's?

If that's the case, we should be able to simply plug in the E0 PCM and have the car function normally. Wonder if I should try it now before the motor swap?

[rkneeshaw]

If that's the case, we should be able to simply plug in the E0 PCM and have the car function normally. Wonder if I should try it now before the motor swap?

do eet!

[99Mystique ATX]

My 95 had ABS and it was controlled by a seperate, external computer module. Wonder if that was how the PATS worked for E0's?

Keep in mind that 95's (At least the early ones) were OBD-I, not OBD-II as the 96 and up models are...

[Bradness]

Keep in mind that 95's (At least the early ones) were OBD-I, not OBD-II as the 96 and up models are...

Of course I'm aware of that! I only used the analogy as a way of demonstrating that Ford has a habit of changing how they control various sensors and actuators via a PC. Early ABS had it's own dedicated controller. Later on, they combined it with the PCM. Get it?

BTW-ALL 95's were EEC4/OBD1.

[rkneeshaw]

Here are the pinouts for a 96 2.5L SE PCM:

Ú--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------¿
| Pin | Circuit | Wire Color | Application | Abbreviation |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 1 | 91S | BK/BL | Shift Solenoid 2 | SS2 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 2 | 91S | BK/O | Malfunction Indicator Lamp | MIL |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 8 | 91S | BK/BL | Intake Manifold Runner Control | IMRCM |
| | | | Monitor | |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 13 | 8 | W/BL | Flash EPROM Power Supply | FEPS |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 15 | 9 | BR/BL | BUS (-) | BUS - |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 16 | 8 | W/BL | BUS (+) | BUS + |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 21 | 8 | W/R | Crankshaft Position Sensor (+) | CKP + |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 22 | 9 | BR/R | Crankshaft Position Sensor (-) | CKP - |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 24 | 91 | BK/Y | Power Ground | PWR GND |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 25 | 91 | BK/R | Case Ground | CASE GND |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 26 | 9 | BR/BL | Ignition Coil 1 | COIL-1 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 27 | 91S | BK/Y | Shift Solenoid 1 (CD4E) | SS1 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 29 | 14S | P/BK | Transmission Control Switch (CD4E) | TCS |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 30 | 8 | W/BK | Octane Adjust | OCT ADJ |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 31 | 8 | W | Power Steering Pressure Switch | PSP |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 35 | 8 | W/BL | Heated Oxygen Sensor - 12 | HO2S-12 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 36 | 9 | BR/BL | Mass Air Flow Sensor Return | MAF RTN |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 37 | 8 | W/R | Transmission Fluid Temperature | TFT |
| | | | Sensor | |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 38 | 8 | W/GR | Engine Coolant Temperature Sensor | ECT |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 39 | 8 | W/P | Intake Air Temperature Sensor | IAT |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 40 | 14S | P/BK | Fuel Pump Monitor | FPM |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 41 | 14S | P/BL | A/C Cycling Switch | ACCS |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 42 | 91S | BK/R | Intake Manifold Runner Control | IMRC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 45 | 91S | BK/BL | Low Fan Control | LFC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 46 | 91S | BK/W | High Fan Control | HFC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 47 | 91S | BK/GR | EGR Electronic Vacuum Regulator | EVR |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 48 | 8 | W/BK | Clean Tach Output | CTO |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 51 | 91 | BK/Y | Power Ground | PWR GND |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 52 | 9 | BR/GR | Ignition Coil 2 | COIL-2 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 54 | 91S | BK/W | Torque Converter Clutch Solenoid | TCC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 55 | 89 | O/Y | Keep Alive Power | KAPWR |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 56 | 91S | BK/O | Vapor Management Valve | VMV |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 57 | 8 | W/BK | Knock Sensor | KS |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 58 | 8 | W/P | Vehicle Speed Sensor | VSS |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 60 | 8 | W | Heated Oxygen Sensor - 11 | HO2S-11 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 61 | 8 | W/GR | Heated Oxygen Sensor - 22 | HO2S-22 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 64 | 8 | W/GR | Transmission Range Sensor (CD4E) | TR |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 64 | 8 | W | Neutral Gear Switch/Clutch Pedal | NGS/CPP |
| | | | Position Switch (Manual | |
| | | | Transmission) | |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 65 | 8 | W/BL | Differential Pressure Feedback EGR | DPFE |
| | | | Sensor | |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 69 | 91S | BK/Y | Wide Open Throttle A/C Cutoff | WAC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 71 | 95 | GR/Y | Vehicle Power | VPWR |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 73 | 91S | BK/GR | Injector 5 | INJ-5 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 74 | 91S | BK/BL | Injector 3 | INJ-3 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 75 | 91S | BK/W | Injector 1 | INJ-1 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 76 | 91 | BR/W | CMP/TSS Ground | CMP/TSS GND |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 77 | 91 | BK/Y | Power Ground | PWR GND |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 78 | 9 | BR/Y | Ignition Coil 3 | COIL-3 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 79 | 8 | W/BL | Transmission Control Indicator Lamp | TCIL |
| | | | (CD4E) | |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 80 | 91S | BK/BL | Fuel Pump | FP |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 81 | 91S | BK/R | Electronic Pressure Control (CD4E) | EPC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 83 | 91S | BK/Y | Idle Air Control Solenoid | IAC |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 84 | 8 | W/P | Turbine Shaft Speed Sensor (CD4E) | TSS |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 85 | 8 | W/P | Cylinder Identification | CID |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 86 | 91S | BK/W | A/C Pressure Switch | ACPSW |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 87 | 8 | W/R | Heated Oxygen Sensor - 21 | HO2S-21 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 88 | 8 | W/BL | Mass Air Flow Sensor | MAF |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 89 | 8 | W | Throttle Position Sensor | TP |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 90 | 7 | Y | Vehicle Reference Voltage | VREF |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 91 | 9 | BR | Signal Return | SIG RTN |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 92 | 29S | O | Brake On/Off Switch | BOO |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 93 | 91S | BK/Y | HO2S Heater - 11 | HTR-11 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 94 | 91S | BK/BL | HO2S Heater - 21 | HTR-21 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 95 | 91S | BK/O | HO2S Heater - 12 | HTR-12 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 96 | 91S | BK/GR | HO2S Heater - 22 | HTR-22 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 97 | 95 | GR/Y | Vehicle Power | VPWR |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 99 | 91S | BK/R | Injector 6 | INJ-6 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 100 | 91S | BK/O | Injector 4 | INJ-4 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 101 | 91S | BK/Y | Injector 2 | INJ-2 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 102 | 91S | BK/O | Shift Solenoid 3 | SS3 |
---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------´
| 103 | 91 | BK/Y | Power Ground | PWR GND |
À--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------Ù

It was hard to find. This is where I found these on my 96 Ford CD:

PCEDs\Description and Operation\Car Electrical Schematics\2.5L Contour/Mystique > Powertrain Control Module (PCM) Connector PIN Usage

Lets get a pinout of the RJL1 from someone

[todras]

I've been looking for almost 3 hrs. straight on a 98 CD and can't find anything like that.

[Keyser]

Ryan - I swapped in three different 98 ECU's one right after another into Suneil's car and they all fired up. It was one of the early models with the different antennae ring.

[rkneeshaw]

Ryan - I swapped in three different 98 ECU's one right after another into Suneil's car and they all fired up. It was one of the early models with the different antennae ring.

I thought suneill had a 98 SVT?

[Bradness]

Ryan - I swapped in three different 98 ECU's one right after another into Suneil's car and they all fired up. It was one of the early models with the different antennae ring.

What are you referring to as the "antennae ring"? Is it the PATS ring which is attached to the steering column encircling the ignition cylinder? If so, it should have 4 very small gauge (22-24AWG) wires coming from a green plastic connector. What year was Suneil's car?

I think the simplest way is for me to remove my 96 PCM and install the RJL1 PCM and see what happens. All I've gotta' do is find some time...

[Keyser]

Suneil did have a 98 SVT and the very first few had a different bezel around the actual FM antennae on the trunk. His car did not recognize PATS at all. Which means his original ECU may not have supported it either.

[Bradness]

So you're saying that the audio/radio antenna was used for the PATS? The key fob antenna (remote locking, trunk solenoid, panic alarm) is located in the passenger side A pillar and the receiver box is under the dash behind the glovebox. The PCM is close so I don't see why Ford wouldn't keep all the components in close proximity to minimize wire runs. Was his car a E0?

The PATS ring I pulled from an early 98 E0 has all the wiring running in to the main harness which is attached to the steering column (ignition, airbag, turn signals, wiper controls, etc.). It appears to run towards the PCM but there's a lot of wires in that bundle and I didn't pull the whole harness and untape it to verify. A wiring diagram would be the only other way to figure it out.

[CSVT1214]

Bradness is getting way too confused here.

95-98 = chrome antenna base
98.5-00 = plain black antenna base

It has nothing at all to do with the PCM. He is just saying it was a 98 model because of the antenna base, therefore RJL1 PCM and external PATS unit.

[Bradness]

Bradness is getting way too confused here.

95-98 = chrome antenna base
98.5-00 = plain black antenna base

It has nothing at all to do with the PCM. He is just saying it was a 98 model because of the antenna base, therefore RJL1 PCM and external PATS unit.

If he had of used the usual terminology (E0 or E1) I would have understood what he was talking about. Where's this external PATS unit located?

Let's make this simple and specific. DOES ANYONE KNOW IF AN RJL1 PCM WILL WORK IN A 1996 DURATEC MTX APPLICATION OR DOES THE PATS THROW US A CURVEBALL?

[rkneeshaw]

I dont think PATS will be an issue at all. Someone said they were able to plug in the PCM to a 96 and it cranked, which if PATS was a problem it woulnd't have even cranked.

The only thing I can see as a possible issue is what pinouts are different between the 96 PCM and the 98 PCM. It sounds like there are only like 2 pinouts that are different, that Octane Adjust and the High Speed Fan?

[Keyser]

If he had of used the usual terminology (E0 or E1) I would have understood what he was talking about. Where's this external PATS unit located?

Let's make this simple and specific. DOES ANYONE KNOW IF AN RJL1 PCM WILL WORK IN A 1996 DURATEC MTX APPLICATION OR DOES THE PATS THROW US A CURVEBALL?

One more time. On Suniels car that ADC installed a turbo kit on, we were having issues with a chip for a different RJL1 that the customer said would not fire due to PATS. We plugged the chip into Suniels car and it cranked over. To make sure he had PATS we installed another RJL1 computer and it cranked over. Conclusion = We could not use Suneils car to test the chip because on the early SVT's PATS was not a part of the equation and the ECU would work. If a Pre 98 does not have PATS the RJL1 ECU should work. How do we identify early SVT models? They still had the chrome antennae ring.

[mjsvt]

i got 2 pcm for sale

[Bradness]

I've started tracing some of the pinouts for the 98 PCM and it appears there will not be a PATS issue as the wires coming from the PATS ring do not lead directly to the PCM. However, some of the pinouts appear to be in different locations (eg: PO #46, wire colour BK/WHT on a 96=high speed cooling fan relay, PO #46 on 98=not used, BK/WHT wire is used at PO #70 on 98). So there could be functional issues.

Does anyone have a schematic for the early 98 PCM c/w descriptive info. on circuit pinout functionality? All I can find is pinout info. as it equates to wire colours. Haven't found the circuit chart detailing wire colours to circuit functionality.

The 98 Ford CD I have causes my PC to crash/lock up.

[fastcougar]

I have 2 SVT PCM's if anyone is interested, PM me. Sorry, didn't mean to hijack this thread, but one of my PCM's is an RJL1.

[rkneeshaw]

For archives: releated thread here: http://www.contour.org/ceg-vb/showthread.php?t=21895

[rkneeshaw]

Well I grew a pair and simply swapped my XXY2 for the RJL1 SVT PCM and gave it a rip. The car cranks when I turn the key but wont turn over. Does this sound like a PATS issue? Some of the custom tunes we've tried on my XXY2 did the same thing, but I dont know if its related or not. Any opinions?

[Pole120]

If it was a PATS issue the engine wouldn't even crank....

[todras]

Did you have an aftermarket chip in it when you tried?

[rkneeshaw]

Did you have an aftermarket chip in it when you tried?

Nope, straight up stock PCM, no modifications, no chips, no tunes.

[RodneyBur]

Did you check for spark or fuel?

[rkneeshaw]

No I didn't. I noob, how can I check that?

[95pgt-t]

when i did a "full" svt swap into my 96 i wanted to do the same thing your doing..no luck. i even brought the car to a sct tuner..had him disable pats(or try to) nothing...even had him try to copy all the svt ecu specs onto a chip and use it on my 96ecu...still nothing. i think if you can get the key for the svt pcm and all the external pats wiring/antenna you can get it to work

[95pgt-t]

If it was a PATS issue the engine wouldn't even crank....
had the same issue....it would crank and crank and crank...but we found that the fuel pump wasnt turning on